30 Mar, 2009 in
Asia-Israel connections . Tags:
asian; chinese; Cross culture; interracial; jewish; relationships;
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Quite by accident, I made my way to a forum topic discussing something I wasn’t really aware of before on the net. Turns out that some people claim there are quite a few American Jewish guys that choose Asian girls as their partner for life. Here’s an interesting look at things from an Asian female perspective with "Asians: The New Shiksas?" :
I was at a party in Sunset Plaza recently where a woman walked over to me and accused: "Could you leave some for the rest of us?"
I didn’t know this woman, and she left as quickly as she came, saying something about her empty martini glass, so I didn’t have an opportunity to ask her what she was muttering about.
A mutual friend was kind enough to be indiscreet and fill me in. Apparently, the woman was left waiting by the phone for several days and nights by a man who was later discovered to be pursuing a woman of the Asian persuasion.
Was the woman right? Are we Asian women indeed the new shiksas? And are we stealing all the men?
Anecdotal evidence abounds. Take a look around your temple, family bar mitzvahs, even Hollywood parties: That nice, successful Jewish boy has a willowy Asian woman on his arm. [...]
First, the question of racial stereotypes. All of my interviewees laugh their heads off when I mention the oft-heard theory that some men — Jewish or otherwise — are attracted to Asian women because they are deemed more submissive. [...]
Similarities, they say. All the couples list similarities between Jewish culture and Asian culture — both Jews and Asians place great importance on education, family, respect for elders, they said. [...]
Could it be then that in these modern times of unprecedented freedoms — freedom of religion, freedom from being forced to date parentally preapproved candidates — that men and women meet at school, at work or through mutual friends and simply fall in love without participating in a cultural phenomenon? Maybe there is more intermarriage because we as a people have grown more aware of each others’ similarities.
Are American Jewish guys into Asian girls? Are they tired of Jewish girls? A Jewish guy B wrote Gil at "Being Jewish" :
I am proud to be a Jew, and I will certainly marry and raise my children to be Jews as well. There is no question about this, for what else am I, if not Jewish? However, I can say with almost absolute certainty that I will probably not marry a Jewish girl, because we have remarkably different values about what’s important in making a relationship work.
Why? Because many Jewish women expect to be "taken care of" (read: live very well). This is fine with me. The problem, Gil, is that their expectations are unrealistic. By forcing us to submit to "the interview" that so many men complain about, they expect us to be able to show at the outset of the dating relationship that we are capable of providing them (and future children) with the standard of living that their parents attained, or better.
In contrast, my Asian girlfriends have never cared how much money I make. What’s important to them is that I know how to have fun and still treat them like ladies, in addition to being responsible enough to keep a good job. Jewish men are marrying Asian women in increasing numbers because these women take a traditional view of the male/female relationship. They know how to take care of us (and they do), in addition to knowing how to be taken care of (and showing their appreciation for it). Moreover, their values tend to be centered around making the relationship work, rather than in how well they’ll be able to live. These are some of the qualities I’ve found in dating Asian women.
Interesting. A thread opened up on Style Forum to discuss this mail "Asians of the world, Jewish men steal your Asian women!":
Coho – Many Jewish women I’ve talked to are well aware of this phenomenon and some have wrote blog entries expressing their anger. I’ve seen some of my Jewish friends using the phrase "I’m Jewish" to pick up Asian girls. That phrase is the equivalent of my black friends’ "my parents are still together"when approaching a black girl.
Coho – I agree. His assumption about the "Asian girlfriend" is ridiculous. What if she came from a relatively strict Christian upbringing? I’ve been friends with a Korean woman who is Baptist and she told me that she would like to marry only Christians (her father is a community Baptist preacher), race comes second. Of course, there are people who are easy going, but living a full Jewish faith, like any others (Catholicism, Buddhis, Islam, etc.), require enduring self-abnegation. I am Catholic and sometimes I see no point in attending a Sunday mass which I have neither head nor heart for. Thank you for posting in my thread DarkNWorn. I think you’re a learned individual and your opinions many times elucidate the subject at hand and elevate the discussion to a higher plateau of intelligent exchange.
Shraka – Perhaps the reason Asian women are picking Jewish men (assuming this is accurate) is simply because they represent some of the classic family values that the Chinese women want (A lot of non Jewish white guys in Australia don’t want families, or it’s not high on their agenda), with the advantages of a white guy over a Chinese one.
rnold – I have a Jewish friend that says Asians are the Jews of the new Millennium.
I think I know what he means. When I was a little boy in the 1950s there was the stereotypical Jew. Usually perceived as an emigrant or son of an emigrant who would work hard and have their children leapfrog into the professional ranks in one generation.
Somebody there posted a link to a website called "Asian Nation" with a page on "Interracial Dating and Marriage". Some interesting stats in there.
Weird, eh? What do you think about all this?
yuri | March 30th, 2009 at 2:56 am #
what an intersting post, it also happens to be the issue that I'm keenly interested in :) after having seen and learned from "interracial" couples in Toronto. I can't articulate my thoughts for now, but do want to say – ah, I can't stand this language of some people: "stealing our men/women". stealing? what does that mean? "could you leave some for the rest of us?" also implies some sort of victimization (like, these girls 'take away ours"). I don't know what to think yet, but I get irritated a bit… ugh, I once heard this Korean guy saying "what a waste of national resource" (strictly literal translation of mine) when he saw a Korean girl with a local non-Asian guy. not sure if you could imagine how disgusted I was hearing that! :P I'm wondering where this notion is (really) from, how it affects the (cross-cultural) couples, and how we deal with cultural script and make compromise with personal goals and interests. afterall, I think it's upto every individual's interpretation of self and relationship… that never stops evolving. umm definitely more to think about. keep sharing fili :)
MJ Klein | March 30th, 2009 at 7:09 am #
it just proves what we already know to be true: Jewish men are smart. ;)
Fili An | March 30th, 2009 at 5:46 pm #
Yuri – :D I thought you might have something to say about the topic.
Yeah, the use of "stealing" "ours" with a strong statement about "us" and "them" bothers me everytime, though it's sadly quite common. Not sure if there's any real way to address this sort of thing.
Fili An | March 30th, 2009 at 5:47 pm #
It kind of makes me wonder what that proves about Jewish women, then … ;)
No name | March 31st, 2009 at 3:32 pm #
I am Asian. I have dated guys of different nationalities. But in my eyes, I don´t see their nationalities, I rather see their quality of a nice human being. Once I was annoyed by an European guy trying to approach me. He is absolutely Asian fetish. I asked him why he likes me, he could not give me any clear answers. I refused him and he turned to a vietnamese girl and he was refused again. Now he is together with an indonesian girl, actually the last Asian lady approachable in his circle of friends. I know many examples of intermarriage, some persist and some end up with divorce.
Jewish women are sexy, beautiful and smart. Take a look on Bar Refaeli and Natalie Portman. Natalie Portman is absolutely my favorite Hollywood star! It´s ok that you guys like Asians or whatever, but please don´t make provocative and generalized statements. Maybe I am a bit too serious on this topic, I am appreciated that many guys like Asian girls, but I feel sick if their admiration is based on my race!
the white wonder | April 10th, 2009 at 2:17 am #
Very interesting post.
As you know, i myself an searching that issue.
After living in Asia for almost a decade(5 different countries), and dating or holding relationships from all levels with 800+ Asian girls from India across to Japan specifing in North Ease Asian girls (AKA Korea, Japan) and majoring in SE Asia & E Asia (AKA Thai, The Phill's), including long term serious relationships lasting for over 2 years (in two seperate cases), my final concultion is to Marry a Jewish girl only.
(one long sentance that was).
Fili An | April 10th, 2009 at 3:16 am #
The White Wonder – 800+, eh? :S
Having read some of what you write in your blog, I would say – no offense intended – that your view of the female gender is far from standard, and that the way you refer to Asian girls, in specific, has a strong flavor of neocolonialism and criticism to it, despite you sometimes framing those things you judge and look down on as their advantages in finding what it is that you seek.
With that said – I would be interested to hear more about why you came to that conclusion, if you're willing to share.
Fili An | April 10th, 2009 at 3:28 am #
No name – Thanks for sharing your opinion, I appreciate that. I tend to agree with you, though I could also see how someone might generally be more attracted to a certain kind of racial based beauty features over the other. There are all sorts in all races, and general stereotypes never do anyone much good, though we all tend to use them alot.
I too, am a bit puzzled with the local admiration in Taiwan, HK and China to my Caucasian features.
the white wonder | April 10th, 2009 at 8:37 am #
800 in almost ten years mate.
the stats are high, but not that bad.
makes an avarge of 80 a year. a different girl on a weekly basis.
+ three four times a year a massive tour of specific cities in the region (אקא מצעד עשרת ערי המין הטובות באסיה ) where you can pop up th numbers with no effort (+ group events… if you know what i mean).
easy to reach sky rocketing figures.
As for why i came to that conclusion. You will be very surprised, but i'm apparently a very conservative person.
Rolade Berthier | July 19th, 2009 at 8:46 pm #
The views expressed are informative and entertaining. Any intimate cross-cultural relationship is complex: there are as many generalisations as exceptions. The bottom line is that those who have a successful relationship are daring, empathic and tolerant – cognizant of their different religions, languages, socio-economic backgrounds and personal interests. Those who fail forget “there is no love but only proof of love” and “it takes two to tango”
Dr. Rolade Berthier
“Cross-Cultural Liaison – An Inconvenient Love”
Dee | July 21st, 2009 at 8:57 pm #
Really, who knows why people get together? It’s really a matter of personal experience and tastes. I am an ethnically jewish woman and I’ve never dated a jewish man in my life – and I can try to generalize to figure out why (adversion to religion, israeli conservative politics, materialistic suburban culture) -but that does not make sense because a) many non-jews are also this way and b)many jewish guys/ladies are probably like me – a bit isolated from the herd and we do run into eachother once in a while. There’s just no interest.
My first was an anglo-saxon christian, and since then I usually chased men who were like him till he was out of my system. So maybe everyone has a different path and everyone we meet creates new connections in our brains. Good experiences and bad experiences with enough people of a certain group could do that.
Relationships are like that always. People have experiences that shift them away or towards certain features/attributes/interests..
Recently I’ve had more and more positive interactions with asian friends and asian men, and now I’ve developed attraction to certain traits that I connect with those positive feelings. A white friend of mine called it “asian fever” which I felt uncomfortable about. There’s something almost perverse that is implied by this, as if you go past a certain line of ethnic boundaries, you are “fetishizing”. Nobody said anything of the sort when I dated white tall blond men, and in a way I feel that I look more like some of the asian men I’m dating. The comment earlier about height expectations made me laugh actually, because the last man I was with (an amazing happy confident man) is filippino, and we found out that we were exactly the same height – 5’2.5″ (As a side not, this is exactly how much height doesn’t matter)
Anyhow, just wanted to share the female perspective.
Lisa A. | July 22nd, 2009 at 8:37 am #
I must say there were some broad generalizations in this article (nothing a little worldly experience can’t fix lol) but I noticed something you said about the similarities of principles and the basis of each culture, asian and jewish. It seems that cultures that can mesh and come together to a point where both sides reach a comfortable medium is essential for these kinds of relationships to last. The ability to relate to one another is the glue that binds human relations. I read something similar in <a href=”http://viewsonir.blogspot.com” and it was interesting that other people feel the same way.
guest | October 30th, 2009 at 10:30 pm #
advantages of a jewish white man over a Chinese one?
I find that highly offensive. If you are saying that Jewish , WHITE men, are better, you are just another modern day Nazi equivalent who advocates the good old aryan race
true, a lot of asian women date white men, but the number of asian men dating white women are fast catching up
just because you can score with an ugly asian girl doesn't mean your still not the same LBH, or loser-back-home, like you really are :)
Fili | October 30th, 2009 at 10:33 pm #
guest – I think you might have missed the whole point of the article.
Spike | November 3rd, 2009 at 6:49 am #
Well, when it comes to stereotypes, there are far more non-Jewish white men hunting Asian women in Asia than Jewish ones.
Most of the women I've met have never heard of Jews or Judaism.
And, during that brief period when I belonged to the Jewish Community Centre in HK, I was surprised to see single Asian women also joining, clearly searching for Jewish boyfriends/husbands, based on stereotypes that hold no more water than western stereotypes about Asian women. Except for the ones about us usually being well endowed (physically as well as having nice trust funds), of course that one's true! “Hey baby, I'm just like Brad Pitt only Jewisher! Let's go to my place and I can show you my gefilte fish collection. And my closet full of neuroses.” Works every time.
Fili | November 7th, 2009 at 5:14 am #
:) Yep, my point exactly, though these type of positive stereotypes I'm not sure I mind so much.
Another Jewish guy in Hong Kong, eh? not that many of us around…
Fili | November 7th, 2009 at 11:14 am #
:) Yep, my point exactly, though these type of positive stereotypes I'm not sure I mind so much.
Another Jewish guy in Hong Kong, eh? not that many of us around…
Zach | January 21st, 2010 at 11:27 pm #
I'm a jewish white guy and I love asian women. :)
hsuboi | February 22nd, 2010 at 5:46 am #
There is one particular thing that concerns me:
“I am proud to be a Jew, and I will certainly marry and raise my children to be Jews as well. There is no question about this, for what else am I, if not Jewish? However, I can say with almost absolute certainty that I will probably not marry a Jewish girl, “
I have observed this common phenomenon among my mother's Chinese friends' daughters who have married young Jewish men. There is a tendency, especially amongst Confucian Chinese Americans, to adopt their husbands' customs(including religion). The same goes for their mixed children(whom are of Han Chinese ethnicity as well as Jewish). It is lamentable that Chinese women lose their heritage in these circumstances.
In addition, and also in direct relation to this quote: Judaism is traditionally passed by the mother. Why should a exogamous Jewish man impose his culture onto an Asian wife(in this case, Han Chinese). Is her culture not worth as much as his?
I fear partial “ethnocentrism”.
(please comment: it would really help to discuss this.)
Fili | February 22nd, 2010 at 8:45 am #
hsuboi – I agree this is a concern, though this could be more gender based, women tending to adopt their husbands' cultures. Western women with Chinese men, as rare as that may be, do seem to move towards the Chinese culture, if only not to let the husband lose face with his own family and culture. But, yeah, both cultures are worthy, it would be interesting to discuss and see how those can – if at all- coexist together at the same time.
Cheng | March 20th, 2010 at 5:51 am #
Jewish men and asian girls are the new power couple. They make beautiful couples and its a great . I love my Jewish husband and don't regret it ever
Fili | March 20th, 2010 at 6:10 am #
Cheng – that's nice to hear. I like mixed couples, warms my heart.
Thanks for sharing that with us :)
pubpubpub | April 14th, 2010 at 4:53 am #
I've noticed that and it's freaky. It's like Jews are treating them like something trendy, an Asian wife. Sick.
pubpubpub | April 14th, 2010 at 4:54 am #
What a strange comment.
movie girl | July 18th, 2010 at 11:36 pm #
Hey, where's the love for the sistas? lol :)
But to whomever said that he can't stand the language like “stealing our men/women” (I think it was Yuri), I'm with you on that one, dude. As an African American young woman, I don't like hearing that kind of language. I seem to hear it quite a bit from sistas about white women “stealing black men”(but honestly, I only heard it on tv and movies), but I do hear a little bit of complaining from some female relatives of mine. Now, I haven't dated quite yet, but I'm interested in black men, but that does not mean that I will limit myself. I would like to experiment dating all kinds of men, whether Jewish, Asian, Hispanic, or otherwise. I guess I would be concerned about the person being in a different political party from myself and not in one of the three monotheistic religions, I think it may be harder for me. Now as for the religion aspect of it, if we found a happy medium, I'd be okay with that, but the political thing…yeah, they may have to be a moderate to the left for me(that's terrible, huh?).