Chinese perception of Israeli media coverage of the China Olympics

http://www.thenhbushman.com/ MJ Klein

welcome to the new China – Entitlement China, where no “infraction” of any sort is allowed. China demands apologizes for personal opinions. they get all upset over nothing, just like children. they are in fact, emotionally immature.

Anonymous

您需要学习，您不缺年纪和肚皮的尺寸，您缺的是智慧。

http://www.thenhbushman.com MJ Klein

welcome to the new China – Entitlement China, where no “infraction” of any sort is allowed. China demands apologizes for personal opinions. they get all upset over nothing, just like children. they are in fact, emotionally immature.

http://www.filination.com/blog Fili

MJ – :S :(

I’d try and avoid general statements about “China” and the “Chinese people” as much as possible and to see the important message behind this regarding how the Chinese perceive western coverage of the Chinese. There is something dangerously patronizing, if not worse, in the last two sentences you wrote.

http://www.filination.com/blog fiLi

MJ – :S :(

I’d try and avoid general statements about “China” and the “Chinese people” as much as possible and to see the important message behind this regarding how the Chinese perceive western coverage of the Chinese. There is something dangerously patronizing, if not worse, in the last two sentences you wrote.

cat

Why Ms. Wang would say:” I would somehow tolerate this stupid comparison in any other country – but sorry – not in Israel”?
Does Fili, or any other Israeli, if he has got even a basic knowledge of the Jewish people’s miserable history during the WWII, understand the reason?

cat

Why Ms. Wang would say:” I would somehow tolerate this stupid comparison in any other country – but sorry – not in Israel”?
Does Fili, or any other Israeli, if he has got even a basic knowledge of the Jewish people’s miserable history during the WWII, understand the reason?

Joe

as much as i understand why the chinese are hurt, and as much as i agree that there is a lot of prejudice etc., i am sad to say that i somewhat agree with MJ.
i am trying not to generalize but about 90% of the chinese i’ve met to date and talked to them about this topic of western media and public opinion (and this means a few hundrends) – talk the same way.
the discorse is not one of “you are wrong and hear us out why” but more of “we are hurt and if you don’t say sorry we will kick your ass”.
of course, this is not unlike the way israel treats what is called “antisemitism” in europe.

i think that it is not a case of “deep rooted cultural differences” like you hope, but another case of the old rule “they only understand force”, which seems to fit ont only in the middle east.

(and if you think when was the last daoist ruler in china, and what happened after him – this goes well with my little theory).

Joe

as much as i understand why the chinese are hurt, and as much as i agree that there is a lot of prejudice etc., i am sad to say that i somewhat agree with MJ.
i am trying not to generalize but about 90% of the chinese i’ve met to date and talked to them about this topic of western media and public opinion (and this means a few hundrends) – talk the same way.
the discorse is not one of “you are wrong and hear us out why” but more of “we are hurt and if you don’t say sorry we will kick your ass”.
of course, this is not unlike the way israel treats what is called “antisemitism” in europe.

i think that it is not a case of “deep rooted cultural differences” like you hope, but another case of the old rule “they only understand force”, which seems to fit ont only in the middle east.

(and if you think when was the last daoist ruler in china, and what happened after him – this goes well with my little theory).

cat

the discorse is not one of “you are wrong and hear us out why” but more of “we are hurt and if you don’t say sorry we will kick your ass”.
_______________________
If a Chinese really tries to explain why, I’m afraid 90% of the people brainwashed by the western media would not accept it at all.

cat

the discorse is not one of “you are wrong and hear us out why” but more of “we are hurt and if you don’t say sorry we will kick your ass”.
_______________________
If a Chinese really tries to explain why, I’m afraid 90% of the people brainwashed by the western media would not accept it at all.

cat

“they only understand force”

________

The fact is not the Chinese only understand force, but they at last find, with great pains, that the West only understand force.

cat

“they only understand force”

________

The fact is not the Chinese only understand force, but they at last find, with great pains, that the West only understand force.

Joe

i think i was a bit misunderstood.
i am not blaming the chinese for they way they feel and the way they react (and i know “the chinese” is an awful generlization, but so is “the west”).

what i am saying is that just like the west, the chinese also understand how useful it is to use force. i wrote that the slogan “they only understand force” is true to mankind. sorry if it came as an attack on china. i am trying to say that there is no essential difference between china and the west in this sense.

i think that to blindly blame china is just as big as a mistake as to blindly defend it.

and i know many would say that one of the reasons for the rising nationalism in china is that it at least in part a resault of all the wrongs the west has done it since mid 19th century.
as true as that may be, we should also remember that the history of foreign policy in china (again – as well as in other parts of the world) shows that power was more in use than dialog. when the chinese were storng enough – the took what is today xinjiang, qinghai, xizang, and yunnan by force. when not – they were conquered by outsiders (weather from the steppe, or europe).

i think that it is interesting to see the difference between israelis abroad (at least me and some i know) and the Wang Yu’s reply here.
israelis know that a threat like this is somewhat meanningless. so although 90% of the times it is not understood, and the brainwashed european doesn’t listen – we keep trying.
and again – not because we are better than the chinese. but because we are weak and have no choice. the rule of “force” applies to us as well, only from the other direction.

to sum up – all i meant was that the chinese are no better and no worse than anyone else. and it is right to criticize the western media and its attitude towards china, but it is wrong to use these kind of threats.

sorry if i was misunderstood. :-)

Joe

i think i was a bit misunderstood.
i am not blaming the chinese for they way they feel and the way they react (and i know “the chinese” is an awful generlization, but so is “the west”).

what i am saying is that just like the west, the chinese also understand how useful it is to use force. i wrote that the slogan “they only understand force” is true to mankind. sorry if it came as an attack on china. i am trying to say that there is no essential difference between china and the west in this sense.

i think that to blindly blame china is just as big as a mistake as to blindly defend it.

and i know many would say that one of the reasons for the rising nationalism in china is that it at least in part a resault of all the wrongs the west has done it since mid 19th century.
as true as that may be, we should also remember that the history of foreign policy in china (again – as well as in other parts of the world) shows that power was more in use than dialog. when the chinese were storng enough – the took what is today xinjiang, qinghai, xizang, and yunnan by force. when not – they were conquered by outsiders (weather from the steppe, or europe).

i think that it is interesting to see the difference between israelis abroad (at least me and some i know) and the Wang Yu’s reply here.
israelis know that a threat like this is somewhat meanningless. so although 90% of the times it is not understood, and the brainwashed european doesn’t listen – we keep trying.
and again – not because we are better than the chinese. but because we are weak and have no choice. the rule of “force” applies to us as well, only from the other direction.

to sum up – all i meant was that the chinese are no better and no worse than anyone else. and it is right to criticize the western media and its attitude towards china, but it is wrong to use these kind of threats.

sorry if i was misunderstood. :-)

cat

Thanks for your clarification.
You are indeed easy to be misunderstood in your last comment.

cat

Thanks for your clarification.
You are indeed easy to be misunderstood in your last comment.

theworldsucks

As a Chinese, I am profoundly shocked by general obnoxious Israeli media racist attitude hostility displayed toward china. I remember China had protected and harbored thousands Jewish refugees during wwii. And Chinese always friendly and sympathetic to Jewish cause. And this is how you reattribute to us …the shameless ungratefulness is profoundly shocking. I want to say, if news about Israel like this keep spreading in China, no more Israel will be welcomed anymore to china.

theworldsucks

As a Chinese, I am profoundly shocked by general obnoxious Israeli media racist attitude hostility displayed toward china. I remember China had protected and harbored thousands Jewish refugees during wwii. And Chinese always friendly and sympathetic to Jewish cause. And this is how you reattribute to us …the shameless ungratefulness is profoundly shocking. I want to say, if news about Israel like this keep spreading in China, no more Israel will be welcomed anymore to china.

http://www.filination.com/blog Fili

theworldsucks – as a non-Chinese who appreciates China, what you write here and the way you write is in the core of the Israeli criticism towards China. What you’re doing here, and what Mr. Wang Yu did, was to threaten those who criticize China with isolation and retaliation. To those who believe in free speech and voicing one’s opinion openly, this is unacceptable and enforces the criticism made.

Those reporter don’t represent Israel, they represent themselves. I’m an Israeli voicing my own opinion against theirs. Furthermore, your interpretation of the sympathy China has given to Israel (which you refer to as the Jewish state) is highly controversial, as is the reporter’s remarks on China. I’m afraid this isn’t an Israeli issue – it’s a more general issue the westernize media has with China and Israel here is just an example familiar to me.

The way to address this, would be to rethink China’s branding and work together with international media to emphasize China’s stronger attributes.

http://www.filination.com/blog Fili

theworldsucks – as a non-Chinese who appreciates China, what you write here and the way you write is in the core of the Israeli criticism towards China. What you’re doing here, and what Mr. Wang Yu did, was to threaten those who criticize China with isolation and retaliation. To those who believe in free speech and voicing one’s opinion openly, this is unacceptable and enforces the criticism made.

Those reporter don’t represent Israel, they represent themselves. I’m an Israeli voicing my own opinion against theirs. Furthermore, your interpretation of the sympathy China has given to Israel (which you refer to as the Jewish state) is highly controversial, as is the reporter’s remarks on China. I’m afraid this isn’t an Israeli issue – it’s a more general issue the westernize media has with China and Israel here is just an example familiar to me.

The way to address this, would be to rethink China’s branding and work together with international media to emphasize China’s stronger attributes.

theworldsucks

Dear fili,I appreciate your reply and your openmind enough to apprecaite chinese culture, but your cheap 2 cents of ‘freedom of speech’ is overly redundant. If western idea of ‘freedom speech’ become a cover to racism, promoting hates and barrier to communication among the mankind, then such freedom should be put under check. You don’t want to say the thing which you won’t say to your neighbor to people of another nation. The taken is not Chinese can’t take criticism as you suggested and people of you nation believe, only if criticism based on truth and fact check, but after being west for more than 11 years, I have realized it’s not about fact and truth, it’s all about demonize china to maintain the illusion of west superiority. The sad thing is I found myself become anti west and that wasn’t the case when I was in China. And I will go back to China to tell people what the west including Israel is really about. That’s my off time doing on Chinese internet anyway.

theworldsucks

Dear fili,I appreciate your reply and your openmind enough to apprecaite chinese culture, but your cheap 2 cents of ‘freedom of speech’ is overly redundant. If western idea of ‘freedom speech’ become a cover to racism, promoting hates and barrier to communication among the mankind, then such freedom should be put under check. You don’t want to say the thing which you won’t say to your neighbor to people of another nation. The taken is not Chinese can’t take criticism as you suggested and people of you nation believe, only if criticism based on truth and fact check, but after being west for more than 11 years, I have realized it’s not about fact and truth, it’s all about demonize china to maintain the illusion of west superiority. The sad thing is I found myself become anti west and that wasn’t the case when I was in China. And I will go back to China to tell people what the west including Israel is really about. That’s my off time doing on Chinese internet anyway.

Anonymous

theworldsucks @8:28 a.m. on the 15th, appears to be bummed out that he(she) is going back to China against his (her)will. I hope they remember to bring a medical mask and bottled water. All returnees are advising me against going to Mainland- apparently Respiratory problems are common. And good luck blogging w/o censorship from the CCP.

As usual,you were level-headed and correct,FiLi. Pay no mind to the Psychiatric Disorders.

http://(lipstickona)pig.com mike dunn

theworldsucks @8:28 a.m. on the 15th, appears to be bummed out that he(she) is going back to China against his (her)will. I hope they remember to bring a medical mask and bottled water. All returnees are advising me against going to Mainland- apparently Respiratory problems are common. And good luck blogging w/o censorship from the CCP.

As usual,you were level-headed and correct,FiLi. Pay no mind to the Psychiatric Disorders.

http://www.filination.com/blog Fili

theworldsucks – what can I say? you feel what you feel, you see the truth and facts as you see them, and there’s little I say to make you see things differently. Fact is, generalizations are always a problem. I think the main issue some people have with China has to do with the government being an authoritirian state, where human rights and personal liberties are controlled to a certain extent.
I don’t think the criticism made goes against the Chinese people as a whole, and sometimes – it’s quite the contrary, people from other countries sympathize with the Chinese people and would like to see them have a better life and a more free society. The problem starts when they interpret their own lives, usually in democracies, as being better, while I understand that some Chinese don’t necessarily see it that way and are proud of their government and country.
I don’t suggest the Chinese people can’t take criticism, I only say that the way you responded suggests that -you- can’t. Instead of encouraging dialog and understanding you’re promoting nationalism and a sense of cultural war. Being “anti west” is a big statement, and for that I can only say that many people in that “west” have done nothing to deserve your “anti”.

http://www.filination.com/blog Fili

theworldsucks – what can I say? you feel what you feel, you see the truth and facts as you see them, and there’s little I say to make you see things differently. Fact is, generalizations are always a problem. I think the main issue some people have with China has to do with the government being an authoritirian state, where human rights and personal liberties are controlled to a certain extent.
I don’t think the criticism made goes against the Chinese people as a whole, and sometimes – it’s quite the contrary, people from other countries sympathize with the Chinese people and would like to see them have a better life and a more free society. The problem starts when they interpret their own lives, usually in democracies, as being better, while I understand that some Chinese don’t necessarily see it that way and are proud of their government and country.
I don’t suggest the Chinese people can’t take criticism, I only say that the way you responded suggests that -you- can’t. Instead of encouraging dialog and understanding you’re promoting nationalism and a sense of cultural war. Being “anti west” is a big statement, and for that I can only say that many people in that “west” have done nothing to deserve your “anti”.

Dak

Most Chinese are shocked when they stay a little well in western countries because of western media that are so hostile to China and Chinese in general. The reseaon for this is that Chinese media always benign towards westeners and Chinese people expect others do the same. Chinese people in general are not aggressive and bad mouth toward other people due to their Confucian believes. They do not abuse and curse other people with no reasons. They admire other’s acheivements and different cultures. They think all people no matter of their skin color or religous can be friends. However, this does not apply to most westeners, especially those westeners with short history and those lack of their own cultures. Those newly evolved races are aggressive, arrogant, greedy and ignorant. Buddhist, Confucian, Islamic and Hindus are oldest civilizations and they are not belong to those newly evolved races. They are benign. They do fight but with reason. They do not want things belong to other but they fight for thier own right. Chinese need to change their mind set and learn to be a bit aggressive and learn to critisize others. Not all sheeps there but there are a lot of wolves on this planet.

Dak

Most Chinese are shocked when they stay a little well in western countries because of western media that are so hostile to China and Chinese in general. The reseaon for this is that Chinese media always benign towards westeners and Chinese people expect others do the same. Chinese people in general are not aggressive and bad mouth toward other people due to their Confucian believes. They do not abuse and curse other people with no reasons. They admire other’s acheivements and different cultures. They think all people no matter of their skin color or religous can be friends. However, this does not apply to most westeners, especially those westeners with short history and those lack of their own cultures. Those newly evolved races are aggressive, arrogant, greedy and ignorant. Buddhist, Confucian, Islamic and Hindus are oldest civilizations and they are not belong to those newly evolved races. They are benign. They do fight but with reason. They do not want things belong to other but they fight for thier own right. Chinese need to change their mind set and learn to be a bit aggressive and learn to critisize others. Not all sheeps there but there are a lot of wolves on this planet.

http://www.filination.com/blog Fili

Dak – I find your statements to be very biased, if not flawed. I hope you’ll forgive my historical shortcuts, but – to say that Communist China is a Confucianist society is a very problematic statement, after over half a century of self-re-education of the Chinese masses. It is only recently that the Chinese communist party is re-embracing Confucianism and promoting it within China. To say that all “evolved races” are aggressive, arrogant, greedy and ignorant is an aggressive, arrogant and ignorant thing to say. To put down their own culture while praising the Chinese is at the core of what troubles the Chinese commenting here when they feel it being done to them. Living in Taiwan, I don’t think anybody, especially the Chinese, need to learn to be a bit aggressive. If anything, we should all calm down, breath in and out, and slowly work on enhancing our cultural sensitivity and understanding.

http://www.filination.com/blog Fili

Dak – I find your statements to be very biased, if not flawed. I hope you’ll forgive my historical shortcuts, but – to say that Communist China is a Confucianist society is a very problematic statement, after over half a century of self-re-education of the Chinese masses. It is only recently that the Chinese communist party is re-embracing Confucianism and promoting it within China. To say that all “evolved races” are aggressive, arrogant, greedy and ignorant is an aggressive, arrogant and ignorant thing to say. To put down their own culture while praising the Chinese is at the core of what troubles the Chinese commenting here when they feel it being done to them. Living in Taiwan, I don’t think anybody, especially the Chinese, need to learn to be a bit aggressive. If anything, we should all calm down, breath in and out, and slowly work on enhancing our cultural sensitivity and understanding.

blicket

Dak – You sir/madame just hit it out of the park! I feel sorry for the people of China because they truly are clueless to the negatively views westerners perceive towards them. On the other hand..maybe I’m glad they don’t.

Western media’s opinions are like a$$holes…they’ve all got one. people needs to stop getting their ‘opinions’ from the media and maybe, just maybe they should form one on their own for once! maybe visit china and do some real investigation?!? oh wait is that too dangerous? I mean China is a place where they where they have ninja, buddahs, rickshaws and eat with chopsticks…chopsticks!? on no how will I eat?

blicket

Dak – You sir/madame just hit it out of the park! I feel sorry for the people of China because they truly are clueless to the negatively views westerners perceive towards them. On the other hand..maybe I’m glad they don’t.

Western media’s opinions are like a$$holes…they’ve all got one. people needs to stop getting their ‘opinions’ from the media and maybe, just maybe they should form one on their own for once! maybe visit china and do some real investigation?!? oh wait is that too dangerous? I mean China is a place where they where they have ninja, buddahs, rickshaws and eat with chopsticks…chopsticks!? on no how will I eat?

blicket

Fili – I don’t think they can be anymore ‘calm’ when they don’t know even know it’s happening. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with praising one’s heretige and bashing others..this exists in every culture no matter how crummy they really are. hell look at the greeks they’be been riding that “civilization” pony till this day, brazilian-soccer, italian-food, list goes on and on (ofcourse these inaccurate generalizations said to make a point. no offence intend)..so why the F not! If you can’t fight em join em.

blicket

Fili – I don’t think they can be anymore ‘calm’ when they don’t know even know it’s happening. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with praising one’s heretige and bashing others..this exists in every culture no matter how crummy they really are. hell look at the greeks they’be been riding that “civilization” pony till this day, brazilian-soccer, italian-food, list goes on and on (ofcourse these inaccurate generalizations said to make a point. no offence intend)..so why the F not! If you can’t fight em join em.

richardlee

good! we need a proper soil to cause antisemitism in China. good try! I think Chinese media is too positive about Jew and Israel. now it is the time to rectify it!
And i don’t think Wangyu’s remarks of going public is threatening. If you think your words are right, what are you afraid of? I am also a professor of a prestigious Chinese university. I will let my students know this. this is the part i can do. free flow of information

richardlee

good! we need a proper soil to cause antisemitism in China. good try! I think Chinese media is too positive about Jew and Israel. now it is the time to rectify it!
And i don’t think Wangyu’s remarks of going public is threatening. If you think your words are right, what are you afraid of? I am also a professor of a prestigious Chinese university. I will let my students know this. this is the part i can do. free flow of information

http://www.filination.com/blog Fili

richardlee – I’m glad you feel you’ve found your opportunity. I’m sure both your university and your students will take pride in your actions. :(

Going public is understandable, it was I who posted this a public blog in English. The issue is how we best address this – it isn’t about Israel or Israelis. I’m Israeli and I come from Israel and I don’t necessarily feel this way towards the Chinese people or the Olympics. This shouldn’t be turned into a cultural war with East vs. West or China vs. Israel, this should raise awareness to cultural sensitivity and a dialog regarding the culture exchange between the two countries.

http://www.filination.com/blog Fili

richardlee – I’m glad you feel you’ve found your opportunity. I’m sure both your university and your students will take pride in your actions. :(

Going public is understandable, it was I who posted this a public blog in English. The issue is how we best address this – it isn’t about Israel or Israelis. I’m Israeli and I come from Israel and I don’t necessarily feel this way towards the Chinese people or the Olympics. This shouldn’t be turned into a cultural war with East vs. West or China vs. Israel, this should raise awareness to cultural sensitivity and a dialog regarding the culture exchange between the two countries.

cat

I guess Zubari will feel much wronged if he knows Channel 1 and Oren do not have to offer an apology for their words.

cat

I guess Zubari will feel much wronged if he knows Channel 1 and Oren do not have to offer an apology for their words.

pug_ster

Unfortunately, there’s always antisemitism out there as well anti-Chinese out there, which others can do little about. It existed in Europe and Nazi Germany before and after WWII. The difference between what Nazi Germany did was that Nazi Germany allowed this hate to manifest toward Jews into their laws, their propaganda, and their textbooks.

This incident where a reporter from Israel, who represents Israel’s Media, and athletes like Shahar Zubari who represents face is Israel say those hateful things towards China is kind of a troubling sign of how this parallel’s to Nazi Germany’s antisemitism is.

pug_ster

Unfortunately, there’s always antisemitism out there as well anti-Chinese out there, which others can do little about. It existed in Europe and Nazi Germany before and after WWII. The difference between what Nazi Germany did was that Nazi Germany allowed this hate to manifest toward Jews into their laws, their propaganda, and their textbooks.

This incident where a reporter from Israel, who represents Israel’s Media, and athletes like Shahar Zubari who represents face is Israel say those hateful things towards China is kind of a troubling sign of how this parallel’s to Nazi Germany’s antisemitism is.

abel

Let’s all get something clear and be in agreement with many distorted facts promoted by everyone. Every river and mountain and tourist spot is polluted. I have been around Rio Grande the river known as the Great River and i will tell you if you want to swim in it and feel proud, go ahead. If you want to swim in the yellow river and feel proud go ahead. If you want to jump in the Danube and feel proud go ahead, if you want to jump in the Rhine and be proud go ahead. Amazon, Mississippi, Mongke, Nile. If you are indeed proud, go ahead and drink it everyday of your life and then you will realize it was very different than say what people drank even 200yrs ago.

Just because your city is not located in a valley and overpopulated don’t think your city will be clean forever and is not responsible for anything, just visit your landfill and come to the reality of what human decay really looks like. Just because your cities wind blows it, sells it to another state/province, dump it underground, bury it doesn’t mean you are great and you are free of guilt, neither am I. Just because your city doesn’t have cameras everywhere doesn’t mean your government is not like any other government on this world bent on control.

Let’s get it straight, all governance is merely for control. whether democracy or dictatorship – what they sell to you is not that much different when their purposes are the same.

abel

Let’s all get something clear and be in agreement with many distorted facts promoted by everyone. Every river and mountain and tourist spot is polluted. I have been around Rio Grande the river known as the Great River and i will tell you if you want to swim in it and feel proud, go ahead. If you want to swim in the yellow river and feel proud go ahead. If you want to jump in the Danube and feel proud go ahead, if you want to jump in the Rhine and be proud go ahead. Amazon, Mississippi, Mongke, Nile. If you are indeed proud, go ahead and drink it everyday of your life and then you will realize it was very different than say what people drank even 200yrs ago.

Just because your city is not located in a valley and overpopulated don’t think your city will be clean forever and is not responsible for anything, just visit your landfill and come to the reality of what human decay really looks like. Just because your cities wind blows it, sells it to another state/province, dump it underground, bury it doesn’t mean you are great and you are free of guilt, neither am I. Just because your city doesn’t have cameras everywhere doesn’t mean your government is not like any other government on this world bent on control.

Let’s get it straight, all governance is merely for control. whether democracy or dictatorship – what they sell to you is not that much different when their purposes are the same.

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